Composting with black soldier fly larvae and composting with earthworms (vermicomposting) are not competing technologies as much as they are complimentary. I’m not speaking from personal experience or research, but I believe it because I was told this by Dr. Paul Olivier, the inventor of the BioPod and one of the pioneers of black soldier fly research.
Add another hobby to the list
It was Dr. Olivier’s work that first inspired me to work with black soldier fly larvae, so his enthusiasm for vermiculture is enough to motive me to try my hand with worms. Apparently the friable compost that is a byproduct of BSF composting is a superior medium for raising earthworms. As soon as my larvae have produced sufficient compost I’ll start a worm bin.
Calling all earthworm enthusiasts
I would like to exchange ideas and information with anyone experienced in vermiculture and who is interested in incorporating black soldier fly larvae into their systems. Feel free to post a comment, send me an email, or better yet, join the BioPod forum and post in the Vermiculture section. The forum is brand new so it’s pretty quiet now, but it should be a good place to discuss these two composting techniques. I started a thread in the Vermiculture section and you can find it here.
Comments 17
Hello,
I have been reading your blog over the past month or so and your efforts have encouraged me to start my own BSF experiment.
A few months ago I put together my first worm bin and now I have three bins on the go. I’d like to combine my three bins into one large bin so I’ve been researching different bin construction and methods for larger worm bins and have come up with my own design which I plan to construct in the next week or so.
I first read about the BSF in a vermiculture forum (can’t remember which one) and was intrigued. What intrigued me was how quickly the BSF larvae consume large whole scraps including meat. Currently I am freezing all of our vegetable/fruit scraps then running them through a food processor to make something like a smoothie. I bag this mixture up and refreeze it in ziploc bags until needed. Then I thaw out a bag put the contents into a 2 liter ice cream container and keep that in the fridge to feed the worms. It’s a “gourmet” meal for them, labour intensive for me, but probably why I’ve seen my worms grow and multiply so well.
When I read that the compost from the BSF was good for raising worms, I really wanted to give this a try. As you may know, most worm-folk don’t feed their worms meat scraps and I was looking for a way to compost virtually all types of wet kitchen scraps. And since the worms don’t have teeth, it can take a long time for them to consume whole peelings. You basically have to let the peelings decompose in the bin before the worms can eat them.
If the BSF larvae are indeed the voracious eaters as claimed and they can consume food “whole”, this would be a great labour-saving step for me in feeding my worms.
From what I understand though, the BSF larvae consume almost 90% of the mass of what they are fed so I would imagine that there wouldn’t be very much compost left to give to the worms. If this is so, I wonder if it would even be worthwhile?
Anyway, I’m not even sure if BSF live in my area of Canada (I’m across the river from Detroit Michigan) but I’m going to take a 5 gal pail and lid, drill a couple holes in the sides, drop in some just-this-side-of-spoiled meat I have in the fridge, snap the lid on and give it a go. I plan to put the pail outside under my lean-to and leave it for a week. If is see anything that looks like the egg pictures your posted, I’ll leave it for another week and see what happens. I’ll keep you posted.
Posted 14 Jun 2008 at 8:41 am ¶Barbara
Thanks for your comment Barbara. I think you can keep a BSF colony easily in warm weather, and with a little research and practice you should be able to store some pupae through the winter for a quick start up in the spring. It’s also possible to maintain an active colony through the winter by insulating them. In cold conditions the larvae develop very slowly so the same individuals can process food waste for months instead of weeks.
I don’t think I would recommend using meat to attract your first BSF. I had good luck with dry dog food (kept moist) and it didn’t spoil very quickly. You may want to consider “seeding” your area with BSF larvae which can be ordered from Phoenixworm.com (see link in sidebar) or other retailers. You would simply feed these larvae until they are ready to pupate and then release them in the vicinity of your compost area. In warm weather the adults should emerge in a few weeks, mate, and then look for a good place to lay eggs. If you have food available nearby they would most likely lay in your container. Please keep me posted on your progress.
Posted 14 Jun 2008 at 11:05 am ¶Hello again,
I started my BSF bin with some moistened dry dog food and after 4 days all I can see in the bin is a hairy mold growing on the dog food. No evidence of fly eggs.
I checked the Phoenix worm site in Canada and their minimum order is $100. I’m not about to spend that on something that may not work for me. I’d order a couple of cups but not 100 bucks worth. Any suggestions?
Posted 17 Jun 2008 at 8:52 pm ¶Thanks, Barbara
I’ve got a few compost bins going (http://www.nifty-stuff.com/compost.php) and in one I’ve got “cold” compost that has already composted a bit. The worms LOVE this cool, damp, dark matter.
Next to this bin I’ve got a mix of 1/4 compost and 3/4 horse manure & pine shavings (http://www.theeasygarden.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=207658#p207658) . This pile has exploded with BSF larvae. I’m very surprised they are doing so well because this compost pile is hot… I mean REALLY HOT at about 150 degrees. Worms hate this heat, but the BSFL’s seem to love it.
BTW, I can’t believe I’m already using acronyms like BSF and BSFL…. what a great blog!
Posted 04 Jul 2008 at 1:11 pm ¶Thanks Nifty.
You probably won’t find BSF larvae in the hottest part of the compost, but they can certainly stand more heat than earthworms.
If you haven’t already seen it you may want to read this article by Dr. Olivier:
Posted 04 Jul 2008 at 2:17 pm ¶ARTICLE
I built a flow through worm composter out of two stacked construction site igloo water coolers and some misc. parts. I had to add a fan controlled by a temperature probe due to high temperatures. Worked extremely well for the last 4 months, requiring almost no effort other than dumping in kitchen waste.
Posted 10 Sep 2008 at 9:40 pm ¶I noticed the BSF larva in with the worms about a week ago and did some research. I’ve increased the type of food waste I put in (everything but bones) and it all disappears very quickly. The BFS seem to stay up top and the worms like it mostly just underneath the surface. So far they are coexisting OK. I have the temperature controller set to keep the bin between 75 and 85 degrees.
I used to have fruit flies and house flies hanging around the unit but they have all disappeared. The only issue so far is the material inside the unit looks a bit on the wet side, but there is no smell so I don’t think it’s gone anaerobic. I will try adding some partially composted leaves to reduce moisture and help out the worms. The combination of worms and BSF would make an amazingly efficient composting system. Hopefully I can manage it so both survive.
I started my 2 BSF projects before I found this web site.
The first was a 5 gallon bucket with wood screws and wood-filler
for the exit ramp/pvc pipe with no lid.
The food was garden scraps only and a very soupy foul mess from
a garbage can full of just this “stuff”.
This bucket was started 130 miles west of Houston, Tx where
I saw my 1st female BSF.
This bucket was brought home to Houston area, days before IKE hit.
In this bucket the wood-filler did not stay .. Hard..
lost the ramp at the food line.
IKE left me with no power for 7 days which supplied me with lots
of food for the second bucket project. So I began my 2nd bucket
at my brother’s house, with power.
This bucket used 1/4″ nylon rope for $1, hot glue gun, metal screws
pvc pipe and still no lid.
Self harvesting is happening in first bucket after more food was
added past lost ramp from cleaned out refrig.
I just scooped out “food” and larvae from 1st bucket and
added it to the second bucket.
I have not noticed BSF yet in Houston, but my food does have lots
of meat currently.
1st bucket, ramps are about 42 degrees.
2nd bucket has 3 ramps, 2 at 45 degrees, 1 at about 40 degrees
and was built before I saw self harvesting happening in the 1st bucket.
I do not have a drain in either bucket.
Posted 21 Sep 2008 at 8:31 pm ¶Andrew, by using the fan you’ve dealt with one of the issues relating to combining worms and BSF. It’s not unusual for temperatures to reach 100º F/38ºC in a BSF colony. Another thing you will have to deal with is the excess liquid that the BSF larvae produce as a byproduct of the large amount of food waste they consume. Adding leaves will help at first but at some point space would become an issue I think.
Sorry I took so long to respond as I’ve been traveling, but I’m very interested in your progress.
Randy, there are definitely BSF in Houston. It sounds like you’re getting the “bugs” worked out of your units.
A lid isn’t necessary if you can keep rain out as well as rodents and other animals that might prey on your larvae. Rabbit cage type mesh can be used to keep critters out. The liquid can become a problem because the larvae can’t operate efficiently below that level. You might want to reserve any dry waste materials like grains and bread to use whenever it gets too wet in your units.
I hope both of you will update us when you get more information.
Thanks for posting.
Posted 23 Sep 2008 at 11:46 am ¶Very interesting idea. Currently I am just starting my vermicomposting business so I’m not going to be adding BSF but I would love to hear how it works out for other people. Regards - Chris
Posted 06 Oct 2008 at 11:22 pm ¶Ive been using my BioPod for a few weeks now after using a rubermaid bucket all summer. Im in NC and the temp has slowed down their aggressive eating. My escape bucket is ready to overflow with mature larve. Whats the best thing to do with these mature larve?
Posted 09 Oct 2008 at 11:20 am ¶Hi Randy25,
You can either release the mature larvae or feed them to birds, fish, lizards etc. A wide variety of animals will eat them, but it’s also good to let some of them go to keep the wild population strong. To release them just dump them out on your property near an area with shrubs so they have some cover.
I’ve released 10’s of thousands of larvae on my property and you still rarely even see an adult. That’s because they aren’t attracted to people and the adults only live a few days.
Posted 09 Oct 2008 at 4:42 pm ¶Thanks! It’s great to have found this information before I completely shoveled out my active compost bin after finding many of these larval critters in there…I freaked out a little yesterday, because I’ve never seen them in my four years of composting. I’m still a little unclear if I need to separate them out. My goal, while using all vegetative household food waste and stuff from the yard, is to create rich compost for use in my garden beds. I’m getting the idea that I can still do that. I had huge amounts of red wigglers prior to this invasion of BSF larva. It looks like the BSF have over run the active compost bin and the wigglers have settled to the bottom, like other folks have reported. I’m certainly thrilled to find that they are not harmful as I initially worried. And the anticipation of shoveling today the whole pile wasn’t exactly exciting! So can someone clarify that I can continue without changing my composting methods? Will I still have some material for my garden or will these voracious creatures eat it all? How do they fare for the winter? I’m in southern Oregon, where it doesn’t get too cold in winter. And the pile is pretty toasty. Thanks. Hope my questions aren’t redundant; I haven’t done a full explore of what’s out there.
Posted 12 Oct 2008 at 5:09 pm ¶Hello Heidi,
I’m afraid I don’t have much experience composting, but I’ve communicated with several people who often have BSF larvae in their compost without any problems. One thing to consider is that you can add several times more scraps to the pill while the BSF are present. You can also add almost any type of food waste including meats, dairy, and citrus, and the BSF will consume it quickly.
I just heard from someone in CA were the temps have just started to cool a bit. They’ve had BSF larvae in the pile for 8 months straight and when they turned the pile recently it caused the colony to migrate en mass away from it. My guess is that the disruption of the warm center of the pile caused them to leave. If I were you I would leave the compost where it is and try to keep the colony going for the winter. As the weather cools the larvae will take much longer to mature. At some point maturation will stall until spring and you can probably maintain the colony through the winter by feeding them regularly. If the food supply is interrupted for too long the heat will dissipate and the larvae will go dormant. Of course if the temperature drops below freezing in the pile they will die.
I hope that helps, good luck!
Posted 12 Oct 2008 at 9:16 pm ¶hey all! i have a worm bin (stacking tray) and tons of BSFL. yes, i freaked first, but then did my research and based on my own observations and what i have read, everyone seems to be doing great (worms & BSFL). i am curious about a couple of things however and would love to get some feedback:
- the “worm castings” are not brown and beautiful and crumbly like i expected them to be - with the BSFL present. it makes it difficult to decide when to harvest the “compost”… any thoughts anyone?
- i have recently seen a lot of the worms on the top of the bedding. the environment is very moist from the larvae, and i am concerned about this upward migration of the worms. how do people keep the moisture levels down?
- what exactly do the worms eat if the larvae consume so much of the food? are they eating the BSFL “castings”. it would seem that the by-product is nutrient rich…
thanks!!
Posted 27 Oct 2008 at 8:30 pm ¶Hi Ade, welcome to the club!
I’m guessing that the castings are wetter than you expected, and perhaps darker. I culture BSF without worms and the castings are almost black. The moisture content of the casting is directly related to the moisture content of the food scraps you add. The presence of BSF larvae allows you to process a lot of scraps very quickly and the combined moisture of all the food is released into your worm bin. BioPods are equiped with a liquid collection jar for this reason. If you want to make the castings drier you can simply reduce the amount of high moisture waste that you add. Adding dry grains/cereals will absorb some moisture.
For what I’ve read the worms do very well on BSF castings. I don’t know enough about worms to guess why they’re at the top, maybe someone else will venture an opinion.
Please keep us posted about any new developments.
Posted 28 Oct 2008 at 8:49 am ¶Updating on the flow through system with BSF and worms combined. Everything worked fine for a while, but I think I put in too much green stuff and the temperature climbed into the high 90s despite the fan. I turned over the material some and added partially mulched leaves but waited too long, all the worms died due to the heat (BSFs did fine).
I ordered new worms right away and upped the fan size. Now I cut up part of a pizza box into roughly 2″ squares and throw them in with every pile of kitchen scraps to break things up. System worked great through October until last week. We are getting temps in the low 20s now at night and the composter is running around 55 degrees, too low for efficient composting. I will be adding a heater this weekend, hooked up to the temperature controller (it can be set for heating or cooling).
The composter runs much wetter with the BSFs. I put in a drain and have the composter up on a stand (12″ diam. plastic pipe) with a small bucket under the drain to catch the drips. The castings I rake out of the bottom of the composter are very wet but don’t smell. I chuck them into the container plants, which seem very happy.
I feed it all the kitchen scraps (pizza, pasta, rice, bread, salad, fruit, whatever) except meat, roughly about 2 gallons of loose material twice a week plus the cut up pizza boxes. When it was running at 75 to 85 degrees it handled the load no problem. With the current low temp it has slowed down. Hopefully the heater will get it back to the 75 degree range.
Andrew
Posted 20 Nov 2008 at 12:03 am ¶Thanks for the update Andrew.
I think the biggest problem with combining the two species will be temperature because BSF larvae compost best at 35º C / 95º F and they can survive up to 45ºC/113ºF.
You may find this blog helpful: http://biosystemsdesign.wordpress.com/2008/07/09/black-soldier-fly-compiled-research-on-best-cultivation-practices/
If you insulate a BSF colony and provide regular food they can generate enough heat to thrive in cold weather.
You probably already know it but BSF larvae will process meats fairly well and also citrus and dairy products.
I’ll look forward to hearing more about your experiments.
Jerry
Posted 03 Dec 2008 at 8:27 pm ¶Post a Comment